Wednesday, November 18, 2009

Silverback: The Truth can Suck

Silverback: The Truth can Suck

Sun, 24 Sep 2006 00:48:48 -0500
R222087
3 years ago
Namaste_Rich

bump to the furnace.


R222089
3 years ago
sisyphus

five


R222090
3 years ago
aaron

Holy fuck…...


R222091
3 years ago
nomadfuckgnn

Fix the spelling errors and I say this could be an article. Front page material.


R222092
3 years ago
aaron

HOLY FUCK!!!!!!!!!
Rich, thank you so much for this.


R222094
3 years ago
aaron


R222095
3 years ago
Angel

WOW

That’s a lot of lying bullshit from Stephen Marshall & Co… fuck that!

Thanks, Rich.


R222096
3 years ago
nation_ov_sheep

Before joining GNN I was lurking about and read many instances when Shogo was called out as a “zionist shill.” There was/is a member here, If_Fetch, and he and Shogo would goad each other till no end…pretty entertaining I must say! If_Fetch, if you’re still here and reading this… thank you! me thinks Shogo is a zionist shill as well. His words definitely reveal him to be just that! HA!


R222097
3 years ago
Kcoztips

Shogo is in fact Coder, and he slipped up when making that post – he was no doubt logged in under the wrong account, realized his error, and quickly edited. You can see in that thread both accounts were used during the discussion.

Further up the thread someone offers coder a blunt for fixing something… I guess he took their advice and got stoned, than forgot who the hell he was Ha, ha ha ha… ho ho, hee hee hee.

Coder/Shogo… ya dam puppy… it takes years and years of practice to accomplish such feats of espionage when stoned.


R222099
3 years ago
Kcoztips

Oh yea… BIG FIVE Mr. Rich, your attention to detail in spy cracking is top notch.

Just as I have cracked one of fennec’s phony profiles who still visits here… sometimes they forget what they say to you in privet.


R222101
3 years ago
aaron

40 votes, top blog, LMAO.

Good morning, Overlords. Eat some shit.
And don’t tell us it means nothing.

IF IT MEANS NOTHING THEN WHY WAS IT SECRET, MOTHERFUCKERS!!!!!!

You let that slimey ass-sucker have access to information that you were given in trust.

You let him give everyone hell while you publicly executed Fennec.
Is the Fennec thing messed up in this? Did shogo really hack fennecs shit?
Did fennec message you about it, maybe accussing you thinking you were the only ones with access to his account?
Did that start a shit-storm that culminated in the drama of his banning?

How many of the shitty one-votes were shogo abusing the power you gave him?
How will we ever know?

In fact, why even ask you?

WHY DID YOU LIE?

Post Modified: 09/24/06 03:13:50

R222106
3 years ago
carcinogen

We need a real system of moderators, like every other fucking forum out there, with the capability to see ip addresses… To stop the mass-usage of multiple accounts.

It needs to fucking stop. Now.


R222107
3 years ago
carcinogen

If this is true, which it seems in the realm of possibility (with Shogo being a proficient coder and all), I’ve lost all faith in GNN.

if {shogo=coder and Silverback tried to cover it up
}
then {fuck GNN, I’m out of here
}


R222109
3 years ago
Mercury

“me thinks Shogo is a zionist shill as well.”

I concur wholeheartedly.
“We need a real system of moderators, like every other fucking forum out there, with the capability to see ip addresses” – carc..

I don’t think so… Because i can guarantee you one of those moderators would release it to outsiders.

I can see it, a moderator gets an e-mail from their local Bnai Brith… then, next thing that happens is, I’m getting handcuffed.

That would be the day many people would leave GNN.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 04:10:55

R222111
3 years ago
carcinogen

I can assure you that the government already knows our IP addresses. The powers-that-be do not need to solicit such information from GNN moderators.

That’s what the telecommunications industry is there for.


R222113
3 years ago
aaron

Its not about the government. Its about shogo.
I would never consent to him getting my IP and email.
They know thats true for many of us.
Thats why they lied.

Fuck GNN

Post Modified: 09/24/06 04:20:17

R222114
3 years ago
Darios

I was gutted to find out that Shogo had gone.

I’m even more gutted to find out that Stephen told us a bald faced lie.

If Namaste’s info is correct then it means Stephen is worse than the politicians and mass media magnates he claims to oppose. He’s worse because he not only behaves like them, he claims to be at the heart of a bastion of “(r)evolutionary media” resisting “their” domination.

The complete lack of transparency and accountability on this site is no different to the same complete lack in politics. The evasion of uncomfortable questions, the hypocrisy, the myopia, the complete fucking lack of progress, not to mention the numerous instances of volte face are all symptomatic of the mass media and politics that many of us who come here sought to escape. Instead we find the whole sorry story repeated for us in miniature.

So, what’s your alibi Stephen?


R222115
3 years ago
Angel

Here’s your fucking investigations section, assholes.


R222117
3 years ago
Darios

If a satisfactory response is not received we should reformat Namaste’s blog into an article and all vote it to the front page.


R222118
3 years ago
BetterRed

I can assure you that the government already knows our IP addresses.

Not necessarily. A (high anonymous) proxy server would make their job a lot harder at least.

We need a real system of moderators, like every other fucking forum out there, with the capability to see ip addresses

Not for me. I would rather the gov. etc know my IP than some of the right-wing basket cases that duck up here – inc. ones bearing caducei.


R222119
3 years ago
EvilJosh

Daniel Pipes is a good friend of my family’s.


R222120
3 years ago
qui_vive

What would a satisfactory response look like??


R222121
3 years ago
ill_logik

wow what a blogshell going off early sunday morn…..damn good eye for detail rich. this is sum drama


R222122
3 years ago
Darios

What would a satisfactory response look like??

Perhaps I should have just said a response never mind a satisfactory one. As you asked though – a satisfactory response, for me, would be one that convinced me that Stephen was not full of shit.


R222123
3 years ago
BetterRed

oh, a 5.
Find it hard to believe that Silverback would lie so blatantly, esp. in reply to a poster that clearly had more than a suspicion as to Shogo’s nefarious activities.

It seems to me that the 911 and 77 ‘incidents’ are snowballing, not because of any clear scientific evidence, but rather the response of those who believe in the official story. Ridiculous though some of the assertions are it is a fact, for example, that both the usa and brit attacks were accompanied by ‘exercises’, which more or less exactly mirrored the actual attack, carried out by the authorities in both those countries. As far as britian is concerned, it is old news that the police ‘fitted up’ people left and right for ‘IRA’ bombings they were either too inefficient or too involved to solve.

Another worrying aspect is Bush’s admittance (TWICE over thirty days) that he SAW the first plane hit BEFORE entering the classroom Freudian Slip?=
I know the guy is a moron, but still…

I can maybe imagine Anthonys distress as he sees his beloved ‘revolutionary’ yet sensible guerrilla site turning into tin-hat alley. But this black-ops solution, if this Shogo thing is true, seems to me to be a case of shooting yerself in the foot.


R222125
3 years ago
Darios

I can maybe imagine Anthonys distress as he sees his beloved ‘revolutionary’ yet sensible guerrilla site turning into tin-hat alley.

All of the problems and issues that this site and community have encountered have been avoidable, predictable and unnecessary.


R222129
3 years ago
zark

Disgraceful behaviour.

***********

are www.guerrillanewsnetwork.com and www.gnn.tv exactly the same?

www.guerrillanewsnetwork has no forums

www.gnn.tv has the forums

If these are 2 completely separate entities, the latter providing a link through to the gnn.tv site shouldnt we be made completely aware of this?

It wouldnt surpise me if Stephen was involved editorially with www.guerrillanews=
bq. Underground organization working to expose people to global issues through guerrilla programming through music videos, articles, and investigative reports.

but not with gnn.tv=
bq. Check out the Sundance award-winning American Blackout, by GNN’s Ian Inaba … Check out the GNN 2.0 blog to get the latest news about site updates and …

****************************

Post Modified: 09/24/06 06:00:17

R222130
3 years ago
Darios

In light of all of this, the GNN wikipedia entry might need updating.


R222131
3 years ago
BurningMonk

shogo=coder=cinis?

;-)


R222133
3 years ago
qui_vive

lappe’ shill? ha!


R222136
3 years ago
silverback

As I told you, Shogo is not an employee of GNN, he worked as a contractor for about 2 months and did a few things for us back in the spring and summer, but has not worked for us since. So the response was true in as much as I was being asked a direct question.

Obviously this is a technicality and won’t satisfy the anger on this thread, and the reason I did not try to engage it more fully than denying it is frankly because he doesn’t do anything for us anymore and I don’t have the time right now to get involved in a huge drama. Guess it’s going to happen anyway.

Had I been asked the same question back in May, I would have had to confirm it. And then I would have simply said that, like any person who we hire to work on the site, we did a rigorous check of their work and did several interviews (by phone) to make sure we could trust him with the keys to the site. The fact is that, as I have learned with fennec and several other users on the site, how they protray themselves and act online has almost nothing to do with their true personas. And, given the caustic nature of Shogo’s id, and the way you all go at each other from time to time, I was initially worried. He promised me everything would be absolutely professional. It was. He worked diligently and with a love for the site and hope to make it better for all the users that far surpassed my expectations. I am only sorry we have all been too busy to carry the work forward.

When the shit broke, he decided to bag his account. I thought of organizing a call with you Rich, but again am mired in a very stressful edit of HolyWars right now that is literally taking 12-14 hours a day and I couldn’t fathom getting into this since it is all past tense.

I know a lot of the fear comes from a suspicion that user passwords would be accessible to him. The fact is they are encrypted in the database. Nobody can see them except for the users themselves. Anyways, this really speaks more to the bullshit of the forums and how you treat each other. Josh is one of the smartest and more chill people I have gotten to know of late and yet he has not problem trashing people on-line in a way that would be offensive in any public sphere. Do I understand it, no. But the same goes for a lot of other people here, so I accept it. And when the work he did was good, cheap, efficient and drama-free, he proved himself and we kept on going. Our next phase was to do the chat and then create an RSS feed to get the blogs wider rating in the web. But now I am not sure that stuff will get done without someone entirely new learning the massive system of code that Jessey designed. Josh did that without charging us and openly stated his amazement that how brilliant – in a mad scientist kind of way – it was.

Yes, we are slow to fix things and have a lot of other stuff going on. But we provide the space and put up fresh articles every day to keep the traffic coming and bring in new people for you to play with. We are often busy just trying to make a living in the political art realm and so when we needed to find someone to fix the bugs you were pissed about, I reached out to the community and he responded. That’s how it happened. Nothing nefarious. Just convenience.

I could have told Rich the truth about his former contractor status. But that’s frankly between us and Josh and since he does not work for us anymore, something that could have only fueled flames. Whatever fears people have about him doing the work, are mute because the work has been done. His access came and went.

Of course I am sorry for this controversy. Especially since Rich is one of my favorite GNNrs. Had this been presented in a more private and informal setting, I would have responded with the full back story. But, being the great muckraking journalists you are, it all came out.

For that: 5.

lates


R222137
3 years ago
uberche

wow… I go off to work for one damn day and everything goes to hell.


R222138
3 years ago
ill_logik

i think why people have problems is it seems Shogo breaks gnns rules for acceptable conduct with impunity. is it because he worked for you guys before? why his conduct is never addressed by you guys (the admins) creates frustration amongst many users, and the vague denial about his work, coupled with rich’s great eye for the investigation, seems to have ticked a few off.

btw i still think gnn is great, and the info i’ve learned here has been invaluble to my political awakening.


R222140
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

I for one, knew of this all along.

I also believe and accept Stephen’s explanation completely.

Being that I did know, I was not that surprised when, on the other thread his remarks were present tense in regards to Shogo being an employee.

I viewed it as a nice ‘dodge’ of the question.

I would have done the same thing.

Now that we’ve dispensed with that, let’s discuss who was sending the “personal info” to ice that started this whole shitstorm about essentially nothing. Who was that person, since we seemingly want to get to the bottom of this?

If it’s not OK to post personal info, then is it OK to send it via PM? If it is, WAHOO!!! I got a bunch I’d like to pass around to certain folks.


R222141
3 years ago
uberche

Tons of people break those rules with impunity. Including most of those who are going to scream and complain about Shogo.

Kinda stupid of Stephen for not being upfront with it all from the begining mainly because the amount of bitching and moaning this is going to create is going to be stupid…


R222142
3 years ago
ill_logik

oh and:

“Anyways, this really speaks more to the bullshit of the forums and how you treat each other. Josh is one of the smartest and more chill people I have gotten to know of late and yet he has not problem trashing people on-line in a way that would be offensive in any public sphere. Do I understand it, no.”

i think shogo is one of the prime people who created the atmosphere of disrespect on the forums.


R222143
3 years ago
ill_logik

....not the only one, by any means, but consistantly flaming threads (especially 9/11 ones). we get it, you don’t believe the CD theory, doesn’t mean you have to fuck every thread about it.


R222144
3 years ago
carcinogen

Thanks Silverback, the honesty is appreciated.

Shogo: Why didn’t you come clean when you were called out? I don’t fully understand the secrecy. I know that there are people here wanting to burn you for being paid at one time by the likes of GNN, but at the same time, there are people here (like myself) who are appreciative of you for coming forward and helping out.

I’m sort of twisted on the issue… I like the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. I don’t feel like I got that from you.

In addition, I would read what you wrote as coder, and what you wrote as Shogo, and saw two very different worlds… You must know how you come off to some people… As coder, you spoke with a strong professional voice, exhibiting a high level of respect and gratitude. As Shogo, you spouted off an endless stream of insults and mockery.

You did GNN a favor for your work. It didn’t go unnoticed…

At the same time, when confronted with being hired/contracted on by GNN (at any time, for any reason, even if you’re not working for GNN anymore), you should have come clean. I personally think that “dodging a question” is being dishonest… The spirt of the inquery was dodged. Avoided. We were all intentionally mislead, and for what?

Instead you telling the whole truth, you ridiculed and mocked the idea until the truth became apparent. And that, in my humble opinion, is very disconcerting.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 07:18:33

R222146
3 years ago
remarcus

But we provide the space and put up fresh articles every day to keep the traffic coming and bring in new people for you to play with.

haha!, take that you nihilistic muckrakers


R222147
3 years ago
Darios

As I told you, Shogo is not an employee of GNN, he worked as a contractor for about 2 months and did a few things for us back in the spring and summer, but has not worked for us since. So the response was true in as much as I was being asked a direct question.

What I get from this statement is despite you understanding the spirit of the question you were asked you decided to purposefully evade it by sticking to its letter.

When are you running for election?


R222149
3 years ago
uberche

“you don’t believe the CD theory, doesn’t mean you have to fuck every thread about it.”

Riiiiight. And if people were making threads about how these things weren’t true the 9/11 truthers wouldnt’ be in those threads continually fucking them? The big problem I have with truthers is their outright hypocrisy. To sit and yell and bitch at Shogo for yelling and bitching at them was just assinine. Both sides in those threads were flagrantly violating the rules without anything happening to them because both sides were violating hte rules. From what I can see GNN mostly seems to care when one person is continually attacking another without reason. Shogo and the Truthers gave each other reasons every damn thread.


R222150
3 years ago
ill_logik

it seemed shogo was the prime instigater most of the time. i agree that the flaming came from all sides, but the disrespect shogo showed was a cut above most.


R222151
3 years ago
alexander

“...As I told you, Shogo is not an employee of GNN, he worked as a contractor for about 2 months and did a few things for us back in the spring and summer, but has not worked for us since. So the response was true in as much as I was being asked a direct question…”

Now that is twisted and rather sad. I think anyone who had asked that question would have clearly meant employed as a contractor, since there are obviously no gnn employee’s per say. That is what is called deliberate misinterpretation of the question. It would have been much simpler and honest to have stated the truth in the first place, rather than demonstrate such a deliberately poor choice of ethics and consideration for the users who have valid reasons to be concerned.

“...Obviously this is a technicality and won’t satisfy the anger on this thread, and the reason I did not try to engage it more fully than denying it is frankly because he doesn’t do anything for us anymore and I don’t have the time right now to get involved in a huge drama. Guess it’s going to happen anyway…”

The fact that you realized you had to keep it secret, and then a month ago, had personally asked at least three other members who found out to keep it secret should have sent off serious alarm bells right then. If it had to be kept “secret”, that should have told you right then, or even back in May, that you were making the wrong choice, whether the person was the right person or not.

“...Had I been asked the same question back in May, I would have had to confirm it. And then I would have simply said that, like any person who we hire to work on the site, we did a rigorous check of their work and did several interviews (by phone) to make sure we could trust him with the keys to the site. The fact is that, as I have learned with fennec and several other users on the site, how they protray themselves and act online has almost nothing to do with their true personas. And, given the caustic nature of Shogo’s id, and the way you all go at each other from time to time, I was initially worried. He promised me everything would be absolutely professional. It was. He worked diligently and with a love for the site and hope to make it better for all the users that far surpassed my expectations. I am only sorry we have all been too busy to carry the work forward…”

There is a deeper question that you seem to have lost, which is both the question of acting as a public trust and the sensitive nature of some people’s presense here. Again, that you knew it had to be kept secret should have been a big alarm bell.

I recall when Anthony first posted about the idea of hiring a coder to work on gnn, at the time I think it was in response to the “open source gnn” thread a few months before Josh was contracted I believe, he stated he was looking for someone to do so who was “compatible with the political views of this board and it’s members”, not an exact quote, but expressly words to that effect. Which gnn or who’s views did he mean?

“...Of course I am sorry for this controversy. Especially since Rich is one of my favorite GNNrs. Had this been presented in a more private and informal setting, I would have responded with the full back story. But, being the great muckraking journalists you are, it all came out…”

Back rooms are the way of the facist. That was the same mistake you made a month back. No, Stephen, you are wrong, and wrong about Rich in this regard as well. You still seem to see it as bad that the truth came out, when in fact only the truth could have set you free.


R222152
3 years ago
ill_logik

i fucking hate the label truther too, i have major ish with the official story, and believe CD is a possibility. i’m far from dogmatic on the issue tho, but i do like to discuss the possibility, in a civil atmosphere ideally.

i also think shogo doing some code for gnn is far from a big deal, the denial more curious then anything. coupled with the abusive attitude of shogo it’s makling for some great sunday morning threadin tho.


R222155
3 years ago
BlackPacker

I hate to jump into the drama, but Anthony’s response does reek of real poltik, “I DID NOT HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS WITH THAT SOCK PUPPET!” and as for “creation of content” I thought that was what WE were doing. But I have a biger fish to fry.

WHY in the hell would ANYBODY here have access to your real name, IP, and info? True, while Blackpacker was a second acount to HagCel, My IPs hopped all over the place, and my private info was protected by two or three layers of redirects. Not because of dishonesty, but because of protection. I didn’t use BP or HC to flame or cause shit, I did it to protect my ass in the event of server grabs, warrents and harrasment. End License User Agreements are almost always voided once the feds step into play.

Some people in the left call it “security culture”. I was a hacker in my twens and teens and I know the havoc that can arise when a server gets nabbed, containing not only your thoughts and research, but your personal info. I have seen friends and flamers both go to prison in situations that could have been avoided with a modicum of security conciousness, and I think any true guerrilla (The ones with guns not keyboards) would agree that the most valuable information you have that your enemy does not is your location..

When I first signed up on GNN, it was in the midst of the first seizures of indy media servers in europe and a darkening of the political climate in the US. If you are bothered that shogo could get your user info, then you are to blame for putting it on here. Oh shit, so Shogo could have found out that my real name was Hagbard Celine and I have a hotmail address registered to the same name. It’s two tears in a bucket. Fuck it.

If you were bothered by the flame wars in the forums, you could have just ignored the trolls.

The only thing that got under my skin about this entire scneario was Anthony’s reply. I mean, when you look at this, it’s simply interpersonal drama, unworthy of a cover up, or deception. So, when is GNN going open source? lol.


R222156
3 years ago
uberche

“it seemed shogo was the prime instigater most of the time. i agree that the flaming came from all sides, but the disrespect shogo showed was a cut above most.”

I would disagree, those two groups had a hate on for each other for a long time and stalked each other with stupidity.

However arguing who started it would be like debating whether Israel or Palestine started their problems.

I am always reminded of what someone on GNN V.1.0 said to me after a rather long and sordid flamewar we had. We were both assholes to each other but me being a dick at the time refused to see my role int he part, he said to me something along the lines that I need to start to take responsibility for the way others react to me. AT the time I’m sure I said something classy like “eat a cock” or something but it stuck with me and it’s something everyone involved in this stupidity needs to take to heart.

“also think shogo doing some code for gnn is far from a big deal, the denial more curious then anything”

That I agree with. Stupidity on Stephen’s part I’d say.


R222161
3 years ago
AnPhoblacht

Shogo was an inside job


R222162
3 years ago
ice

“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of Truth and Love has alays won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end they always fall. Think of it. Always.”
-Gandhi

“A time comes when silence becomes betrayal”
-Martin Luther King


R222163
3 years ago
ice

I will use the words of Al Pachino in the movie “Scent of A Woman”

“What a crock oooofffff shit!”

Someone poses a questions and the most vocal here at GNN will ostracize and make it seem like the one who questions is “mentally unstable and paranoid” and you guys let it continue when the questions is waranted.

How disingenuous. THere is a serious lack of character around here.

This can’t be good for Guerrilla moral huh?

Post Modified: 09/24/06 08:28:52

R222164
3 years ago
BingoTheClowno

Silverbback: As I told you, Shogo is not an employee of GNN, he worked as a contractor for about 2 months and did a few things for us back in the spring and summer, but has not worked for us since.

GNN employs shitheads!? This asshole insulted every GNN member that did not agree with his views and you paid him for his services?
Fuck you!

Post Modified: 09/24/06 08:20:58

R222165
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

Rich …

YOU knew at the time, and seemingly had no issue with it.

WHY all of a sudden now.

That goes for a few other people.


R222167
3 years ago
ice

WHY all of a sudden now?”

Oh I don’t know…maybe because he lied his ass off.

Just a guess. But hey…he’s got no time for this DRAMA...right?

Post Modified: 09/24/06 08:26:39

R222169
3 years ago
dikweed

Grim Reapers get what they sow. Or, you made your bed, now you have to lie in it.

And sow, it goes.

Can I get on with my agenda. I partly know what that is. But, what I’m still trying to figure out is, can GNN serve my interests.

I’ll continue to ignore Shogo, if only directly, and hope this least common demonator will . . . just, do something else.

I would not be so bold or inclined to say Shogo is a detriment to GNN if not for Silverback’s conceding. It seems Shogo could come back as something else — as capable as he is.

Time for a new tact.


R222179
3 years ago
carcinogen

Meh.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 09:11:15

R222184
3 years ago
BurningMonk

i was no fan of Shogo but all this hate directed at him is totally unwarranted.

hope he’s still around…

so what he worked on the site? I’m glad someone’s working on it to get it better and i think all of you know shogo well enough to know he understands his shit. he helped some of you guys, didn’t he?

so stop the bitching and the moaning … or haven’t you got anything better to do?

that said, gnn needs to be more open towards its clientele. all this cloak and dagger shit only hurts our reputation. i’m looking at you here stephen. you’re explenation of why you lied (let’s call it wat is) just doesn’t cut it.

peace


R222187
3 years ago
ice

“so stop the bitching and the moaning … or haven’t you got anything better to do?”

I’m guessing not one person gives a flying shit that he worked for gnn.

It’s the cloak and dagger that people are pissed about. It’s being called a “nutter” for asking a perfectly reasonable question…for even THINKING the question.

If shogo would have said “yes I am Coder and I did a small bit of work” and Anthony and Stephen followed…this situation or DRAMA would be far less damaging.

But, in the end, we learn a little more about GNN. We learn a little more about those ‘in charge’ and we wonder a little more about why we continue to participate.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 09:35:40

R222189
3 years ago
silverback

Back rooms are the way of the facist.

I meant that this forum seems to bring out the most caustic elements in people. And so, when presented with the question of whether coder was an employee of GNN with access to people’s private data, I replied straight up. No. He is not. He has not worked for us for months. He did some small fixes.

I could have issued the corollary. That he was working as the programmer at one time. And, as I said, this would have even brought up more issues. Which are coming up now, so fine. Let’s deal with them. Shogo is in no way the only instigator of shit on this forum. My god, if it were only that remote of a problem. A matter trust? Guys, this site is populated by people who use fake names and multiple accounts. Please.

“Shogo” is a shit disturber that has a page on GNN. He, like Fetch and all the others on this forum, has a right to his own privacy. But telling you that Shogo was in fact the programmer, we would have been one step away from divulging his actual identity. He submitted invoices, he is putting the GNN site on his resume, and eventually on his web page.

So think about it for a second, ok? I got it, it’s Sunday. Moral outrage and all that shit. But the fact is that the forum is a pretty harsh space and people have formed negative personas or whatever to fulfill their deeper, darker whims. The decision to contract him to do work was our own. That was not something I felt we needed to put to the community. And nor did you at the time. The work was done, the contract ended. THAT was the primary element of trust. That we could hire someone to come in and do the work who would not fuck with your data and compromise your anonymity. In that we fulfilled our responsibility.

Now, when Rich discovered the Shogo/coder post, shit started to happen and I had a decision to make. I decided to protect “Shogo.” I would have done the same for any of you, even the most obnoxious anti-GNN upstart. That was the choice I made, it’s on me. And I think I have explained it above.

I do not see the failure in the truth coming out. I see the failure in the negative vibe of this community – of which Shogo is partly to blame. Yes, I denied what had happened in the past. Yes, I employed a cute use of language by answering the question directly, he is not an employee. I never said he never had been etc. That was a mistake. I admit that. Anthony isn’t happy about it either. But I chose to do it because it was his privacy I was more concerned about.


R222190
3 years ago
remarcus

so stop the bitching and the moaning … or haven’t you got anything better to do?

/me is reminded of the cackling of old women in rest home debating the merits of ex-lax vs prune juice.

We learn a little more about those ‘in charge’ and we wonder a little more about why we continue to participate.

so, tell me, ice…


R222191
3 years ago
Livingston

i think we learn a little more about what the users are here for more than anything else.
a conspiracy on a site focusing on conspiracies… grand.
let’s revolt “animal farm” style!

i wonder if anything is happening in the news…


R222193
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Since it’s out, Sarcasm knew this as well. He also knows more, but why bother? This is gay and so annoying this as well may drive Sarcasm off…


R222195
3 years ago
ice

“He also knows more, but why bother? This is gay and so annoying this as well may drive Sarcasm off…”

WHat is annoying is the disrespectful way in which you treat people. You act as if yoiu don’t know and that the line of questining is “crazy” or “nutty” or “paranoid”.

Dishonest. Disrespectful.

“This as well may drive Sarcasm off…”

Are you kidding me? Are you ashamed? I can see no other reason for you to leave.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 10:02:03

R222197
3 years ago
ill_logik

this was mildly interesting at first, pretty lame at this point. later EMS.


R222198
3 years ago
remarcus

/me is outraged


R222199
3 years ago
dikweed

ice they’ll bait you forever . . . for whatever reason.

Let’s heed the advice of . . ah . . Livingston, “wonder if anything is happening in the news…”


R222200
3 years ago
Namaste_Rich

Stephen:

As I told you, Shogo is not an employee of GNN, he worked as a contractor for about 2 months and did a few things for us back in the spring and summer, but has not worked for us since. So the response was true in as much as I was being asked a direct question.

It’s called a a lie by ommission, silver- which wiki defines as not really being a lie – but an act of deception. I really don’t know what the difference is between a lie and being deceived. Seems to me their both.

Did it nag at you that you were not being completly honest with me when you replyed? You could have told me. Hell you could have told ALL of us when you first made this agreement with Shogo. As the owner of this site, bringing Josh on to do the site work may have been welcomed by many of us here – with the knowledge that not only was Josh being brought on to do the site improvements , but that he must also must cease with his attacks on GNN users. I think that would have been a great move on your part, and supported by many here (but not all, of course).

Even Shogo (Josh) could have blogged to let us know he was “hired” by you guys to help with the site. He also could have showed his true colors to use in a honest blog about how’s he’s acted on this site over the years – making an effort to treat people with respect from now on. I guess that was too much to ask for though. Better to keep it quiet and tell only a few G’s who you’ve come to know in real life. So be it.

Obviously this is a technicality and won’t satisfy the anger on this thread, and the reason I did not try to engage it more fully than denying it is frankly because he doesn’t do anything for us anymore and I don’t have the time right now to get involved in a huge drama. Guess it’s going to happen anyway.

Yeah, I like how you think deception can be viewed as just a technicality. You would make an excellent politician. Shogo was brought on during the spring and summer to do site work – and at the same time posting under his Shogo handle the way he’s always been – with disrespect. It continued – so he essentially broke that pact with you to behave himself. One look at Hiick’s recent 9/11 thread will show everyone how Shogo chose to act out his online persona he loves so much. So much for a “Restatement of GNN Policies”.

*The fact is that, as I have learned with fennec and several other users on the site, how they protray themselves and act online has almost nothing to do with their true personas*.

So what is that then? Do they have a multiple personality disorder? They are being who they are. This is a side of themselves they represent. Seems to me, on some level, it is a true representation of who they are.

Josh is one of the smartest and more chill people I have gotten to know of late and yet he has not problem trashing people on-line in a way that would be offensive in any public sphere. Do I understand it, no. But the same goes for a lot of other people here, so I accept it.

I have come to the ugly realization of this as well. Not knowing Josh, I can’t make the same statement, I only know what I’ve seen him spew on these boards. His Coder persona was no doubt showing a man that is both professional, and courteous. You are probably right, however. Josh may be a cool guy when he’s not showing off an ugly alter ego that is still a representation of who he is. Do I understand it? No. Do I accept it? Not a chance. Not when people are being attacked and insulted for posting their opiinions. And especially when a policy was instituted to bring that kind of behavior to an end. Obviously, when it comes to enforcing a policy to someone who has worked for you – it doesn’t apply to them.

AS2:

I for one, knew of this all along.

I also believe and accept Stephen’s explanation completely.

Being that I did know, I was not that surprised when, on the other thread his remarks were present tense in regards to Shogo being an employee.

I viewed it as a nice ‘dodge’ of the question.

I would have done the same thing.

Yeah, a nice dodge of not coming clean when presented with the truth, all things considerd. You would have done the same thing? I’ll remember that.

Rich

YOU knew at the time, and seemingly had no issue with it.

WHY all of a sudden now.

I honestly didn’t know, if you can believe that. Revisiting the “Fix it” thread, and seeing the true communication again – then seeing my post in relation to that communication – I can’t believe I didn’t put two and two together at the time. You may not believe that AS2, but it’s the truth.

I only bacame aware of this when I called out Shogo for being insulting on Sander Hick’s 9/11 article – posting the “Restatement of GNN Policies” blog that Anthony wrote. I received a PM that told me Shogo was working for GNN, and that he was Coder. I was surprised by the revelation. But really had no evidence to confirm other than what I was told.

Putting things into perspective over the course of a few months – how Shogo has behaved (even when workinig on site improvements) – I do take issue with the whole thing. I would have preferred to be in the know, like many others here who voted for this blog. The choice not to tell us of the decision when both parties could have let us know is disheartening. You make think I’m really naive, AS2 – and you may be right. But this is how I feel. Take it as you will.

And don’t think for a second that I’m patting myself on the back for posting this as a “job well done”. A real piece of Muckracking Journalism. I am no journalist. I find this whole thing very disturbing – and not sure what to really think. I need some time to meditate over this whole fiasco.

I do believe in giving people a second chance to make things right – including they guy we call Shogo. I am also very pleased at the work he’s done to improve the functionality of the site – given the lack of funding to make those improvements. He’s helped me on a number of occassions with my CSS ignorance – and for that I’m grateful. I do respect Shogo, and when he’s not being such an insultng jerk, his logic and intellect is very much welcome on this site.

I’ll leave it at that for the moment, giving others a chance to post and think things over.

Thank you Stephen for posting your views and apologizing over this. I may not agree with your reasoning for not answering me honestly, with the full knowledge of the truth considering all past events. But hey, I guess that’s why the world is the way it is. For now, I accept that. I really have no choice, do I?


R222202
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Oh, and since we’re being honest here, Shogo always knew Sarcasm’s password. Sarcasm told him it and never changed it.


R222203
3 years ago
ice

“so, tell me, ice…”

Why I continue to participate?

When I first came to this site I was serious about the issues I discussed. I soon realized that the most vocal and the most disrespectful members of the community rarely offered anything but disrespect. Then I was called a “nutter” and labeled a “paranoid mental case” for suggesting that these very users use various screennames.

I was vindicated becauase I was right about that.

Then you have the admins posting things about GNN policy. And, as it has been for years, the most disrespectful members of the community get the pass from the admins. Sure, they may have private messaged them and asked them to be nice…but nothing changes. They get a pass from Anthony and Stephen.

I understand they don’t want a loony conspiracy crazy alienoid did it website. I hardly think that it comes close to that. To suggest that the line of questioning, expecially regarding 9/11, is out of order…is nutty.

To suggest that the line of reasoning that goes on on this site…that is labeled nutty…is more damaging to the site then what is currently being exposed…is nutty.

So, the reason I continue to post here and the reason I continue to participate is to expose the hypocrisy and the lack of respect that even the owners, Anthony and Stephen, have for the community itself.


R222204
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Fuck off you stupid Inner Circle cad.


R222205
3 years ago
Namaste_Rich

sorry for the spelling errors.


R222207
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Oh, Ic? You’re just pissed that you’ve never been part of the community here. Shogo was, will always be, and for that, he’ll be missed and you’re still a whiney shithead.


R222208
3 years ago
Namaste_Rich

^Is this directed at me, Sarcasm?


R222210
3 years ago
ice

Sarcasm, if you are still not willing to accept the fact that I AM a part of this community…then I can’t help you.

Your reaction….I expect this from you. I can’t imagine how I would feel if I was in your possition.

I am respectful when respected. Anyone who has discussed things with me in a rational manner knows this. Anyone who treats me with utter disrespect knows they will get the same in return.

As I told you many times in the past…I remember Inner Circle…and I have nothing to do with him, her, they whoever…it is.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 10:27:41

R222211
3 years ago
Darios

Rich:

Yeah, I like how you think deception can be viewed as just a technicality. You would make an excellent politician.

This is why I don’t trust Stephen. This isn’t just an exception, it’s part of a Modus operandi

Stephen:

He submitted invoices, he is putting the GNN site on his resume, and eventually on his web page.

If the reason for your Straussian noble lie was to protect his privacy you’ve just done a really dumb thing by revealing the above information that now will lead people straight to him.


R222212
3 years ago
silverback

Did it nag at you that you were not being completly honest with me when you replied? You could have told me.

yes. is there anything in my last 4 years of posts and work that tells you it would have struck me as anything but deceptive and, thus, fucked up? this is a situation that got out of control. like i said, when “Shogo” denied his work, i chose to back him up. this was the mistake. the deception was a painful tear in the community fabric that i believe in an have worked hard to build up in its worst moments. ironically, getting him to work on the fixes was instigated to try to revive some positive spirit here. which it did for a short while. now it has falled below the line again and, as i have said before, i am to blame for not thinking out the entire situation in the beginning. Shogo asked me not to divulge his identity toi the group as a condition of working and i followed through. i will say again, Rich, i am sorry that i wasn’t up front with you about the history of that relationship.


R222213
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

NO, Rich, and yes. Y’all are making a huge stink over fucking nothing. Ic is a fucking homo. No, Ic will never be part of any commnuity that Sarcasm is a part of…


R222216
3 years ago
ill_logik

nevermind, too slow.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 10:32:33

R222219
3 years ago
ice

“No, Ic will never be part of any commnuity that Sarcasm is a part of…”

I still don’t know exactly what I did to piss you off. Maybe you could explain it in a cool, and rational manner.

The way I see it, ExcuseMySarcasm, is that since the beginning I have recieved disrespect from you for no apparent reason. My logic is intact, my threads are on issues that are popular, and yet you deem them ‘nutty’ and show contempt whenever I turn around.

Like I said, I don’t understand your bitterness towards Ice. If you honestly felt this strongly, then why have you NEVER sent me a private message to rectify the situation? Seems like it would be a noble effort. Even if it doesn’t amount to anything, it would atleast help me understand why you would not be a part of any community that I am a part of.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 10:39:09

R222220
3 years ago
silverback

If the reason for your Straussian noble lie was to protect his privacy you’ve just done a really dumb thing by revealing the above information that now will lead people straight to him.

yes, well, it became clear that the truth was going to come out and there would be absolutely nothing to be gained from not engaging the community. but thanks for stating the obvious.

This is why I don’t trust Stephen. This isn’t just an exception, it’s part of a Modus operandi

ok, well i have no idea what m.o. you are referring to. nothing like this has ever happened before. darios, your anger at me and GNN goes back to a dispute between you and some of your friends when we were trying to do a UK GNN. and you take whatever opportunity you get to dump on ths site as a form of revenge. that’s another issue altogether.

i can’t spend much more time on this so i will make one last remark that tags onto the reply i gave to Rich.

what was the deeper thrust to the question of whether he was working on the site? it was based on the conern that Shogo the GNN agitante would have access to sensitive material. right? was that the fear? i thought so. given that i knew he had completed his tasks without any compromise to the system or the user privacy, and based on my promise to not disclose his identity, i denied it. just think of it from that perspective for one minute. i was in a bind and hoped it would blow over. the fact that he is not working on the site now gave me an out. marginal, yes, but an out. you guys are raking me over the coals here, and good on you for the high standards. but i think that now that i have explained it, there is an opportunity for less judgmental dialogue.


R222221
3 years ago
ice

“but i think that now that i have explained it, there is an opportunity for less judgmental dialogue.”

I agree. The way I see it, this is a small part of the overall problem. THe problem is much bigger then this and I think that the power to filter out the haters from ones own communications (blog) would be a start to a better GNN. In fact, if I could do that, I would never have cared who shogo worked for, what he did, when he does, who he hates, and who he disrespects. Hell, I wouldn’t even care that you guys allow it to go on for so long.


R222222
3 years ago
BetterRed

This is gay and so annoying this as well may drive Sarcasm off.

Oh no, please don’t go. Sarcasm aside, homophobes worry me. Aside from wondering why sane, well balanced people should give a flying fuck what other people do in the bedroom, I wonder also why anyone on a ‘left-wing’ site would want to promote a nazi viewpoint?


R222223
3 years ago
truthcansuck

I just can’t leave you people alone for 5 minutes, now can I?


R222225
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

My logic is intact

Ha! Fucking Ha! Logic, never. Sarcasm can barely tolerate talking to you in public.


R222229
3 years ago
ice

Sarcasm,
I’m sorry that you have decided that we will never be friends or even part of the same community..ever.

I wish I understood why you feel such bitterness towards ice. If you ever care to explain it to me…please do. I have merely responded to you with the same treatment that you have given me..year after year…for no apparent reason.

If you ever want to discuss your harsh and pent up anger that you obviously feel towards Ice, my private message box is always open for you.

If you are not going to be a part of ANY COMMUNITY that I am a part of, like you said, then you better start packing.


R222230
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Nah, he’ll stay and point out your anioa. You’ll need a target for your attack blogs, or else no one will notice you.


R222232
3 years ago
remarcus

I just can’t leave you people alone for 5 minutes, now can I?

hehe, a thread named after you…

is this your sock-puppet


R222234
3 years ago
remarcus

Nah, he’ll stay and point out your anioa. You’ll need a target for your attack blogs, or else no one will notice you.

you bring out the best in him


R222237
3 years ago
Number5Toad

sigh.


R222238
3 years ago
ice

“Nah, he’ll stay and point out your anioa. “

What you call attack blogs I call ‘addressing the problem’. You would like us to have people disrespect us…and pretend that it’s not happening. Pretend it’s not impacting every discussion that we bring up.

I don’t pretend. If I have to create a blog to address Shogo’s utterly disprespectful nature, if I have to make an attack blog so that we can discuss what many are thinking in private…that Shogo (and others) have continued this negative campaign for years with no reprocutions…and we are sick of it…

Then I will. It’s a reflection of a problem at GNN. If you post GNN Policies then enforce them. If you don’t, the community will do it for you.

Like I said, if you have such a hateful problem with ice…my private message box is open to you. I’ve recieved many private messages praising my communications and many more offering suggestions on how to better communicate my message. Nothing from you however.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 11:13:46

R222239
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Sure, fucktard. Your fucking blog list is either poorly thought out 9-11 threads or attack blogs. You offer nothing else. You’re called a god damn shill by the most credible members of the Truth Movement, and you’re a piece of shit whiny fuck.

Fuck off.


R222241
3 years ago
pumo

i got a few emails this morning from gnn users asking me to check this out (and these came from a few of the more serious posters here)...
i gotta ask, why are you guys wasting your time here anymore? the whole thing is a fake: infotainment at best, but more clearly rebel bait.
most of the threads are bullshit as they are being driven by tit for tat’s by false users (kinda like the fake debates on crossfire), and i am sure anthony and silverback are bullshitting you about how many new hits they recieve a day.
this site is most clearly Orwellian Pornography, a false provocateur.
Stop wasting your time, stop praying to false idols, there is no point in going to see the wizard as he is also the wicked witch, a few of the flying green goblins, and a couple of unnamed extras…
why do you think i was pushing for real identities? this site is a joke, but because we are all moving directly into a fascist stage of our development, it’s a pretty sick joke.
I remember when Stephen referrred to account holders as gamers- no fukin shit.
so you guys woke up to the fact that the moderators and possesors of this site are also liars, opportunists and generally respectless of those they have entrapped. but i’m guessing most of you will try and create some logic that will allow you to continue to flail around in the shallow end as images of big waves are projected onto your little virtual shades. enjoy kiddies, just don’t say i didn’t warn ya…
peace and love,
andrew stromotich
dropframe communications
www.dropframe.ca

ps- the images in your comic of your hero fuking some ho from behind, followed by a “iraqi”(rana i’m pretty sure you freak) woman entering the room and not seemingly bothered? then conversation in a car about when she will be his wife? you have hit an alltime new low tony. you really must be getting paid well to slut this site and the GNN idea out like this (or is it just a byproduct of your anti islamic zeal?). who knows, who cares…


R222242
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Hey look! Our other resident “I’m leaving but not before I stay forever” idiot.


R222244
3 years ago
Darios

but thanks for stating the obvious.

OK I’ll modify my position – you haven’t just done something dumb, you are dumb. Go back and read the specific sentence I quoted from you. If I have to spell it out for you then congratulations, you’ll advance from a garden variety dumbass to a self-absorbed retard.

ok, well i have no idea what m.o. you are referring to

You wouldn’t. You’re thoroughly self-absorbed.

nothing like this has ever happened before

Give me a fully functional search facility on the site and I’ll quote you numerous examples of this m.o. in practice.

your anger at me and GNN goes back to a dispute between you and some of your friends when we were trying to do a UK GNN. and you take whatever opportunity you get to dump on ths site as a form of revenge. that’s another issue altogether.

This is a typical attempt by you to deflect criticism by bringing up something totally erroneous. It’s also part of your overall m.o. I was referring to above. One of the things that has obviously escaped your attention is the difference between how I engage with you and how I engage with Anthony. It’s true that I was very pissed off with what happened before. Had things worked out differently in the situation refer to however, I would still have been levelling the same criticisms at you. Your response is a cheap shot, so let’s put that one to bed now as a means of dealing with criticism from me, shall we, or shall I bring up the aliens talking to you and you pissing away $1 million of someone else’s money on smoking and partying?

I obviously take every opportunity to dump on GNN. That’s why I invested a lot of time in writing articles for you again. Your memory is as selective as your verbiage. There’s a trend at work here – I become more involved in GNN when it looks like things are happening and you guys are as good as your word. When you’re not as good as your word – which is far too often – my involvement level declines.

My criticisms of the site are not some form of revenge as you attest. They are criticisms grounded in your continual failures to deliver on your word or to be at all straight with any of us, not to mention your irritating brand of panglossian doublespeak and dishonest ways of arguing when the going gets tough for you.

This time it’s tripped you up.


R222251
3 years ago
GNNSUCKS

GNN SUCKS


R222258
3 years ago
remarcus

R222266
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

Are you kidding me? Are you ashamed? I can see no other reason for you to leave.

Sarcasm knows nothing of Shame.

He will not leave. He will remain the hypocritical lying Shill he has always been …

It’s good to see he is revealing how close he is to the InnerCircle of GNN.

Stephen and Anthony should be answering why they are allowing him to run all over the top of people the way he does, but they will not.

GNN Cred is non-existant as a result.


R222270
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Fuck off, hilljack. You are twice as foul-mouthed, half the man, and five times more pointless than Sarcasm could ever be.


R222273
3 years ago
Kcoztips

This is highly amusing to me and an interesting discussion… I guess if put in context to a real world situation… it would be similar to having a friend who helps you work on your car, discovers an innermost secrete about your girl and uses it behind your back to get into her pants. So the peoples who feel deceived are right to express it.

In the real world most consider that type of personality the absolute scum of the earth, but this is the internet and a reminder to all… the rules have changed.

I think Shogo needs to make an appearance… “Lucy, you have some splaning to do”


R222276
3 years ago
zark

I know a lot of the fear comes from a suspicion that user passwords would be accessible to him. The fact is they are encrypted in the database. Nobody can see them except for the users themselves.

Anyways, this really speaks more to the bullshit of the forums and how you treat each other

Oh dear. Protecting the abusers.

Josh is one of the smartest and more chill people I have gotten to know of late and yet he has not problem trashing people on-line in a way that would be offensive in any public sphere

exactly. You know full well who the posters are who are offensive, who disrupt thread and who have no interest in issues or disseminating information.

you guys are raking me over the coals here, and good on you for the high standards. but i think that now that i have explained it, there is an opportunity for less judgmental dialogue

I think the judgement is only just beginning.


R222277
3 years ago
ice

Does anyone else find it interesting that certain users continue to post their venom in this very thread? Someone is obviously frustrated and not happy with the fact that this all has come into the open. I can’t see how, given that Stephen is participating in this discussion, that ExcuseMySarcasm can continue to get the free pass like Shogo did. I mean it’s freaking right there. We are addressing the very issue and the problem that brought all this up is manifesting itself in this very thread.

As if to say “so the fuck what? GNn policy? ahhaha”.


R222278
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Nah, it’s quite clearly a fuck you.

He found several links to you calling Shogo an asshole and a douchebag. But that’s just how you roll, right? Talkin’ shit all the time until it serves you.

Fucking asshole.


R222280
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

“_But that’s just how you roll, right? Talkin’ shit all the time until it serves you.
Fucking asshole._”

Nothing hypocrtical in your nature, is there?


R222281
3 years ago
remarcus

ice, get a fucking life. i see only one person arguing incessantly, besides sarc revealing the fool you are


R222283
3 years ago
Continuity

Wow, this is weird shit. You know, I don’t mind at all that Shogo did the coding work. He seems to be skilled in that department.

But let’s face it, the work wouldn’t have been a big deal if some other ‘neutral’ GNN user had been contracted. There might not have been any need for the so-called ‘cover-up’. For example, off the top of my head, if Gregoire (sorry to use your name, pal) had hypothetically volunteered his services, he could have just told everyone without much controversy, if any. And if Gregoire didn’t ‘expose’ himself, and yet someone found out, it still wouldn’t have been a big deal.

We have to ask ourselves why that would be.

I don’t have any conflict with Shogo, nor do I wish him any trouble. But for reasons way beyond me, he frequently tried to make problems with many users, often instigating the conflicts. It’s no wonder he got flak in return. And it’s no wonder other users feel weirded out now, after Rich brought it to a head. There is a perception that Shogo’s work at GNN, and maybe some of his politics, probably gave him a bit of leeway when it came to the Abuse Rules.

Anyway, I’m not perfect and have been known to start a competition or three as well (at least I tried to keep it vaguely within the realms of good taste). Still, in the end, this is just a forum. So talk about information here. Life is short. As funny as it is to watch, don’t waste your time getting in big personal conflicts and sockpuppet wars on teh internut.


R222286
3 years ago
ice

“But that’s just how you roll, right?”

I’ve clearly stated my policy. If get what you give. Over the years I’ve given Shogo pleanty of chances to treat me with respect. There comes a time when you have to give up on a rational discussion. That time was long ago.

My policy has always been “You get what you give”

In other words, you treat me like shit, I’ll be nice and ask you to change your ways. If you don’t, you get what you give.

Are you saying there is something wrong with that policy?


R222288
3 years ago
ice

“i see only one person arguing incessantly, besides sarc revealing the fool you are”

Open your other eye then. My communications are usually cordial and rational. If you are seomhow suggesting that SHOGO is undeserving of all this attention then wtf website are you reading? It’s obviously not GNN.

I find it hard to beleive that you consider ExcuseMySarcam’s comments to me “exposing” ice as a fool…and my comments back as “arguing incessantly”.

But hey, were are on GNN. I’ve come to learn that 2+2 really does = 5…when you are on GNN.

The party line: “all GNN users will take the contstant disrespect from the most disrespectful of users, and don’t say shit about it…if you do…you are “arguing incessantly” or you are being “pissy”“

Post Modified: 09/24/06 12:44:47

R222292
3 years ago
BingoTheClowno

Continuity: Life is short. As funny as it is to watch, don’t waste your time getting in big personal conflicts and sockpuppet wars on teh internut.

It would be dramatic if Silverback turned out to be Anthony’s sockpuppy and EMS Shogo’s. I’d spend an afternoon for that kind of revelation.


R222294
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

EMS was here before Shogo.


R222303
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

Bingo is sorta right, in the past tense anyways.

There was a point when EMS and Shogo did share various sockpuppet ID’s and Passwords.

They used them to antagonize, smear, lie, and generally harrass poster’s whose opinions they disagreed with.

The notion was, “See so-and-so, and such-and such thinks you’re a loon too. Of course with nothing but altruistic motives.

While I don’t rule it out on GNN v.2, they seemed to have abandoned the tactic here.


R222320
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

Yeah, a nice dodge of not coming clean when presented with the truth, all things considerd. You would have done the same thing? I’ll remember that.

If you put it in the perspective of the lesser of two evils, I hope it makes some sense. It’s definately a tough call, but yes I would have done the same thing were I in Stephen’s position. If you read where yeshappysteady originally posted the screenshot, then edited to say “Honesty is the best policy” ... Then read what I said in response, you’ll see that I knew he was coder, but saw that he was doing something positive for the site, and was generally (No, not 100%) comfortable that it was being kept on the QT in that context.

If you believe any Yin-Yang philosophy, that would be how I viewed it then, as I do now.

While I will accept your statement that you did not realize Shogo=coder, It’s head-shakingly amazing you did not. It seemed, at the time, you clearly did, based on your edited comments following Shogo’s “giveaway” screenshot statement.

The question I have then is: How did you come into possession of the screenshot that opens this blog that yeshappysteady created?

It was not up for very long, so only a few people could have downloaded it.

Obviously yeshappysteady had it, being the creator (who snatched it in

LESS than 26 seconds

after it was posted to the server). I have it, but you know I did not send it to you. It could not have come from Google, as it was not on the server long enough for their bots. Seems like YT and tango knew. But you didn’t. OK.

Looking at the timestamp (which I didn’t really need to, as my memory serves me well) It was up for a grand total of less than five minutes in the middle of the day, when there really isn’t that much activity. Could not have been too many folk.

So who aided you in your expose’ with the lynch-pin evidence?

Who is the axe-grinder skulking in the PM’s?

Post Modified: 09/24/06 14:03:27

R222321
3 years ago
ice

“Who is the axe-grinder skulking in the PM’s?”

hahah

GNN’s very own DeepThroat.


R222326
3 years ago
Oluckyman

Is it just my browser playing up, or has the css/textile stuff gone awry since this thing started kicking off?


R222340
3 years ago
Liam

Golly gee. This is a little not-so-great.

Can we use real names, yet, please?

I do, what’s the big deal? The big secret?

Gosh, that really kind of sucks. Really, because mr. Shogo has really been vicious, really, really, terribly, unrelentingly vicious.

It’s nice coding work though!

But fucking-a, couldn’t you have just fucking hired somebody else?


R222342
3 years ago
ice

“But fucking-a, couldn’t you have just fucking hired somebody else?”

I’m guessing it was a matter of money or lack of it.


R222347
3 years ago
uberche

“My communications are usually cordial and rational. “

You’re such a hypocritical lying twat… Sorry but you truely are. You’re going to come here and try and play the “oooh poor me!” card about the way you are treated? I’ve been here since you showed up and I don’t know if maybe you have a true mental condition, if so I’m sorry, but you’ve been an ass on again off again since as long as I remember. You act like a complete psycho to people and than when people get sick of you you sit there in utter shock whining and complaining about how you just can’t understand why you get such bad treatment, than you do one of your lovely “that’s it! This time I’m leaving fo’ sure!!!” and scamper off into the night, of course returning just as ignorant and rude not long after.

Take some god damn personal responsibility for the ignorant and distasteful way people react to you. I’m an asshole at times but I’m freely willing to admit and and accept that when people are back, yeah it’s my own fault.


R222351
3 years ago
blindface

I’ve been gone a little over a year, and come back to this…

Nope, not much has changed


R222352
3 years ago
ice

uberche, I never said I was always nice and cordial. I have a personal policy. You get what you give. I always give people second, third, and even fourth chances.

“Take some god damn personal responsibility for the ignorant and distasteful way people react to you.”

There are only two personas that I have a problem with. ExcuseMySarcasm and Shogo. I rarely treat others with such contempt. But, as I said, with me you get what you give.

I’m not sure how I rubbed you the wrong way but I am sorry. I think that maybe you saw me interacting with Shogo, who treated many like shit, and I returned the favor back to him.

Again, If I was an asshole to you please forgive me. If I was, it usually means that I was returning the favor. I’m not an asshole for no apparent reason.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 15:33:20

R222353
3 years ago
blindface

how’s this for nice and cordial .. go fuck yourself.

/me welcomes myself back..

/me feels right at home..


R222354
3 years ago
ice

“how’s this for nice and cordial .. go fuck yourself.”

Actually, I would consider this ‘less’ then nice and cordial. Do I know you?


R222357
3 years ago
blindface

nope, don’t know me ice or gren or whoever you are..

don’t take it personally. if this is the same site I left awhile ago, you can’t take anything personally.

sorry if I came across as rude.

muh name’s Adam, and you?

EDIT : go fuck yourself

Post Modified: 09/24/06 15:41:27

R222358
3 years ago
deadduck

Since I’ve been coming to GNN for quite some time, I feel that I should chime in.

Aside from anything else, I was really happy with Coder’s work on the site. At the time, I figured that it was either someone the admins knew in real life, or someone from the site wanting to do the work that needed to be done without any persona baggage interfering.

A number of people from the site did a little work for the book a couple of years ago, and almost none of them used their forum handles for that. I know I didn’t. I don’t see that as dishonest, I see a clear disconnect between something done for entertainment (the forum) and something done as work.

Considering that Shogo has been a lightning rod for controversy, to say the least, wanting a clear and impartial way of interacting with the forum in order to do the work just makes sense. It was a smart thing to do. Instead of getting stuff done, we would have had the Coder threads trolled by the likes of Fetch screaming how it’s a Jew conspiracy, or other such shit.

Some of you who are new to v2 also didn’t witness the numerous personal information breaches that he was subject to on v1. Another damn good reason for keeping this all seperate, for the reasons that Stephen has already discussed.

Here’s a final question: does anyone here want their employer reading the GNN forums and what they write on their own time? Want it conflated with their professional lives?

I sure don’t, and not because I think it reflects badly on me in any way, but because those I like to keep my private life seperate from my work life.

It’s that simple.


R222360
3 years ago
uberche

“I always give people second, third, and even fourth chances.”

No, what you do is act like an ass to people. Than one day you stop for an hour or two and sit there acting hurt and offended and ask them to please be nice and can’t we all just get along and than revert back to being an ass again later. It just makes you look like a hypocrite or someone with mental issues. If that’s your second chances you may just want to choose one personality and run with it. If you’re going to act offended and hurt by distasteful words than go with the polite one. Stay polite all the time and act nice and people will have to do the same otherwise they’ll just look like angry children throwing tantrums.


R222362
3 years ago
ice

“Stay polite all the time and act nice and people will have to do the same otherwise they’ll just look like angry children throwing tantrum”

Yo Uberche, I don’t get it. Show me where I’ve been disrespectful to someone that didn’t deserver it, namely Shogo and ExcuseMySarcasm…both who seem to have left. I won’t lose sleep over it and if it’s true, you will see a more constantly polite ice/gren.

So, show me where I’ve been this big bad monster you talk but. Like I said, you get what you give with me. So obivously you can’t use Shogo and EMS as examples because they are dicks and someone had to stand up to them..so I did.


R222363
3 years ago
ice

“sorry if I came across as rude
EDIT : go fuck yourself”

hahah. Nice edit. No offence taken. People call me jay.


R222374
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Stand up to Sarcasm? Every other poster in this thread is politely pointing out how much of a complete ass you are…no one is saying that about Sarcasm, ‘cept for Sarcasm’s private fag-hag.


R222378
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

no one is saying that about Sarcasm

That’s because they mostly realize you are Stephen’s personal pet.


R222380
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Hi, fag-hag.


R222382
3 years ago
ice

“Every other poster in this thread is politely pointing out how much of a complete ass you are”

Suuuureeee they are. Look, what do you want me to do tough guy? You want me to leave GNN alone? Ask me nicely and maybe I will. I think this site has been adequatly debunked..so maybe if you ask nicely….

You take this shit waaaaay to seriously. The truth is you got debunked along with your guerrilla buddies. YOu have no cred. Shogo has no cred. Debunked. The charade is over. Either Change your persona name or deal with it. Either is fine with me.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 16:22:33

R222397
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Please leave gnn forever.


R222404
3 years ago
ice

Ok, I will make a deal with you. Ice will leave but Gren is insisting on staying. What do you say? One is better then none.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 16:54:30

R222405
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Fucking liar.


R222406
3 years ago
ice

“Fucking liar”

I guess that is a no huh?

Look EMS, don’t be angry and bitter at me. People lied and that is undeniable. I don’t see why you are venting all your frustration on one or two people.

The parties invovled (stephen, shogo, anthony) handled the situation very poorly and you are stupidly following in their footsteps by throwing your hissy-fits.

Don’t hate the players hate the game.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 16:58:17

R222409
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

Sarcasm, got a question.

Have you decided to become puppeteer for Mayor_McNerd?


R222410
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

You offered to leave, Ic. Not Sarcasm.


R222412
3 years ago
ice

“You offered to leave, Ic. Not Sarcasm”

First of all I said I MIGHT leave. Secondly, I made you a deal. No Ice but Gren, i Just can’t convince him to stay away. Maybe you should talk to him huh?


R222414
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

ice, don’t you see why Sarcasm is hounding you to leave?

Honestly?


R222415
3 years ago
senssensibilityr

This thread was totally begging for it.

The best part was when I-left-but-now-I’m-back-again-pumoes decided to show up and tell us how this site isn’t g’r‘ll’a enough because it wouldn’t publish his slop articles.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 17:01:15

R222416
3 years ago
ice

“ice, don’t you see why Sarcasm is hounding you to leave?”

What do you mean? Why do you think he is hounding me?

Maybe it’s because he got kicked off his chair and we can’t both fit?

Post Modified: 09/24/06 17:01:34

R222422
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Fucktard, pure fucktard.


R222434
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

ice, for one, I think Sarcasm is a purely fear based organism.

At the moment I believe he is extremely afraid, one might conclude clinically paranoid, you will revisit the connection between GNN and Bill O’Reilly.

Just a hunch.


R222438
3 years ago
ice

GNN and Bill O’Reilly”

Do you think GNN and Bill Oreily still share the same talent agent still?

I don’t see why he would be afraid of that. It was one second best expose’ I would say.

To bad it’s not around anymore. I would put this one right up there beside it…it all its shining glory.

Post Modified: 09/24/06 17:18:01

R222441
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

You live in quite the crazy world there, As(s). Sarcasm fears nothing from you, or ice. He’s just not one to easily suffer the antics of the inane.


R222443
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

“_Sarcasm fears nothing _”

You liar.


R222444
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Well, besides deep water, and sharks. Sharks are creepie.


R222445
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

He’s just not one to easily suffer the antics of the inane.

So, You admit you are an Intolerant Son-of-a-Bitch?


R222446
3 years ago
AreolaSharon2

To bad it’s not around anymore.

Oh but it is.

As some know, I saved a lot of stuff from GNN v.1

You just might be amazed.


R222448
3 years ago
ice

Yea that was a funny thing. If I remember correctly the thread gained a huge amount of viewage and then something happened where it was locked by Stephen. I actually didn’t realize it because I had stopped reading it then someone emailed me asking why Stephen discontinued my thread about GNN and Bill Oreilly using the same high-powered talent agent.

That’s amazing you saved that stuff man.

Can I ask you? What is the explanation of why GNNv1 was lost? I don’t understand how you can lose an entire website.


R222528
3 years ago
nation_ov_sheep

Hey ExcuseMyBullshit, you sure are one angry sonovabitch. Not getting any lately? Sheesh, we all have dry spells but WTF.


R222533
3 years ago
ExcuseMySarcasm

Chalk it up to his general distaste for humans.

Oh, you’re excused.


R222594
3 years ago
Snark

Something sinister afoot?

Pure gold?

Looks like we’re go for liftoff…..


R222599
3 years ago
MarchHare

Wow, Stephen lying, Shogo quitting the site in disgrace, ice being obsessive and AS2 spending his entire day trolling a website and whining about internet injustices.

GNN at its best!
5


R222600
3 years ago
remarcus

golden?


R222601
3 years ago
carcinogen

EMS... chill….

Post Modified: 09/24/06 21:58:50

R222609
3 years ago
lday

aghhh, groundhog yawn,
can i see my shadow yet?
Nope
a few more zzzzzeaze

Happened again?
Shogo’s gone?
good riddance zzzzz

GNN1 dissolved because
independent co-operative research
was getting too close to TRUTH

Too close for comfort for some PTB

‘Commandante’ (ret.) Lawrence Day:
“I never invested in fucsimile gnn2,
didn’t bother to learn fucktile
or scramble up an avatar,
one blog said it all.

I kept my distance

And there’s Shogo directing traffic,
nude with a giant neon overplay sign
on his forehead,
like he just stepped out of Revelations:
I am sayanim,
grr grr
it said.

zzzzzzzz

So long bozo shogo.

turn out the lights eh
on your way out


R222611
3 years ago
truthcansuck

why nude?


R222617
3 years ago
ill_logik

actually come to think of it lday, the lionshare of useful info i got from v.1.0.


R222626
3 years ago
lday

nude//~jungiancode~ = “nothing to hide” “open”, “honest” “without deceit or cover-up”.
—>Shogo’s shadow flip-side presumably

I, of course, know nothing about it
having been asleep at the time.


R222666
3 years ago
BetterRed

Chalk it up to his general distaste for humans.

The word you’re looking for is misanthropist, you misanthropic smartass.


R222686
3 years ago
ShiftShapers

what, so shogo did some work and got a free t-shirt or dvd maybe, and you’re all going to cry about it? i mean come on, was your private info compromized? have you been receiving spam mail or something? are you having trouble posting what you want here at gnn? i mean really, ‘cause if not, what’s the big fucking deal? granted, shogo is an ass-face to me just as much as he is to any of you, but i’ve always just taken him with a grain of salt, and understood his humor and shit-talking to be harmless, which it is.

we’re always bitching about how this site needs work, so why are we butt-hurt just because shogo was the one to do (some of) it? i really don’t see the problem. if someone here has the skills, then by gawd they should be put to use. up until it interferes with our activities here, i don’t see the problem. if all of the sudden i couldn’t post what i wanted here, or if somehow people seemed to be getting my e-mail address from here, i might have a problem. but that does not seem to be the case. deception, of course, isn’t cool, but this seems more like some sort of sick misunderstanding spun into another gnn witchhunt flame war. enjoy yourselves.


R222687
3 years ago
uberche

“what, so shogo did some work and got a free t-shirt or dvd maybe, and you’re all going to cry about it?”

but… but… HE’S SHOGO! HE SAID NASTY THINGS TO PEOPLE WHO SAID NASTY THINGS TO HIM! Don’t you understand?!?


R222694
3 years ago
ill_logik

i think peoples are pissed that maybe he was given different treatment in regards to the rules of conduct because of past employment with gnn. i don’t think it’s the biggest deal honestly, more stupid for the powers that be to try and lie about it. can’t we all just get along…..NO


R222702
3 years ago
uberche

Lying is the only stupid thing that happened. The whole different treatment thing is just foolish as tons of people act like asses and they don’t get kicked off either.


R222728
3 years ago
Porktamer

Yay! I made it through the entire thread. Pure infotainment!

Shogo has always been respectful to me... but then again, I may be of similar school of thick-skinned, sardonic moderates (while still a flaming liberal in the eyes of an ignorant conservative). Maybe, I’ll actually use a real email addy so i can finally receive PM’s. Keep in touch, Josh – whatever your new tag may be.

That being said, this is a

NON ISSUE


R222752
3 years ago
Angel

Being lied to is always a non-issue, but thanks for the confirmation.


R222753
3 years ago
truthcansuck

Well, since Areola has been deleted, I’l repeat his query:

Let’s discuss who was sending the “personal info” to ice that started this whole shitstorm about essentially nothing. Who was that person, since we seemingly want to get to the bottom of this?


R222778
3 years ago
Angel

Yeah… that’s the ticket! How DARE whoever exposed this deception!? Root out the leaker… very White House. Good riddance to bad rubbish.


R222782
3 years ago
Porktamer

Angel:
Shogo wanted his profile and the Coder profile to remain separate (exactly to avoid bullshit drama-fests like this). Silver was just honoring that – being that Shogo had done all of GNN a service. Your sarcasm is not appreciated.

Tell me, why does it matter so much?


R222783
3 years ago
Angel

I’m not here to spoonfeed you comprehension, Porky.

Have a wonderful day.


R222787
3 years ago
Porktamer

meeeee-OOWWW

My ego, is like, so damaged.

Grow up.


R222788
3 years ago
truthcansuck

Yeah… that’s the ticket! How DARE whoever exposed this deception!? Root out the leaker… very White House.

Angel, on reflection I agree with you… My irritation towards the fallout of the action doesn’t make the action itself wrong… Whomever PM’d Ice had every right to do so…


R222795
3 years ago
dankstah

WOW, all of you people!
someone call the whaaaaaaambulance, because we’ve got 50 cases of extreme self importance. Code blue at the emergency room. Grow Up. How about you invest all this time and energy on something constructive, like an issue that matters.


R222837
3 years ago
nogunri

Ah, well it’s good to be back from vacation. Waitaminute… whatthefuckhappenedhere?!?!?!?

Good to be home.


R222866
3 years ago
Snark

Yeah…got home last night and saw everything I’d missed. I should take vacations more often.

I’m not going to get into the drama, for a change. I basically agree with duck, but I’m not going to contribute to this shitstorm of drama.


R222878
3 years ago
Memnoch01

TCS- It was me. I was bored and am a leet hacker.

My bad!


R222879
3 years ago
SilverSurfer

The motivation of the informant was with 100% malicious intent. Otherwise known as evil

He should be exposed and pilloried as well.


R222881
3 years ago
Memnoch01

No it wasnt George Bush, like I said… It was me.

LOTR!!!


R222907
3 years ago
Joshua_McNair

Please, I’m on record calling myself an arrant misanthrope, I can even say it in el espanol.

Soy misantropo.


R222981
3 years ago
Snark

I was bored and am a leet hacker

Isn’t that “l33t h4xx0rZ”?


R223316
3 years ago
BetterRed

Soy misantropo.

My bad. Best I can do is danish, din misantrop.


R223325
3 years ago
deadender

So like can this stuff with Darios and Stephen get a seperate thread?

I’d really like to hear about the aliens…

And as to the rest of the drama,

Who honestly expects this place to represent them? If you want a website that you can set the rules for, with total transparency… go make it.

This place, whether it wants to be or not, really is Emmanuel Goldstein

Raging against the machine here is like farting into a hurricane…

Accept this place for what it is, a unique (if limited) resource… and ignore the stuff that irks you. Save the slings for the debates.

Don’t be a deadender. Play nice.

peace


R223576
3 years ago
futhamucka

Yeesh the amount of swearing and bickering going on in here, it makes all of you taking part in it look bad. Here’s a challenge, is it possible for GNN to go one week. Hell, even just 2 or 3 days, without people hurling insults and abuse around like it’s the most important part of their existence? I’d say, no.

And that’s just a poor reflection on everybody.


R223593
3 years ago
remarcus

/me resists, moves on


R223681
3 years ago
Futuro2076

what was the deeper thrust to the question of whether he was working on the site? it was based on the concern that Shogo the GNN agitante would have access to sensitive material. right? was that the fear? i thought so. given that i knew he had completed his tasks without any compromise to the system or the user privacy, and based on my promise to not disclose his identity, i denied it. just think of it from that perspective for one minute

one second you marginalize him…

But now I am not sure that stuff will get done without someone entirely new learning the massive system of code that Jessey designed. Josh did that without charging us and openly stated his amazement that how brilliant – in a mad scientist kind of way – it was.

one second you make it sound like he knows the whole back end to this site…?

WTF Stephen?

Shogo is smart as fuck, but a fucking asshole.

more than one person has accused him of having ulterior motives… now you give him the keys to the site.

you are a CLASS ACT fucking moron.

just sell this freaking site to CNN or whoever the fuck you and A are jumping through hoops for, you fucking posers.

so when you ban me, you fucking heteros (that for you BetterRed you pussy), get my real handle too… I’m tired of this dirty sock on my hand.

WHAT A FUCKING JOKE THIS SITE HAS BECOME.

Good job Rich… troll yall later!


R223682
3 years ago
Joshua_McNair

So, I’m suppose to report this guy to Anthony through pm?


R223685
3 years ago
Futuro2076

bastard


R224496
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

So who is on the GNN payroll?

Anthony
Silverback
Coder/Shogo

Do any of them pursue 9/11 truth with an open mind? Not to my knowledge.

What is going on here?


R224499
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Cinis
Ian

9/11 truth?


R224500
3 years ago
Snark

What is going on here?

Uh, three people who aren’t interested in 9/11 Truth are running a website.


R224502
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Uh, three people who aren’t interested in 9/11 Truth are running a website.

Seems too systematic, like they are scared of something.

Post Modified: 09/28/06 14:35:35

R224503
3 years ago
Snark

You do realize that people can be totally uninterested and/or unconvinced by some or all of the assertions of the 9/11 truth movement and not be in on a conspiracy, paid shills, CIA disinfo spooks, or Republican activists, right? Just checking. Because that’s where you seem to be driving with that post.


R224505
3 years ago
tango

I just caught this in one of AS2’s posts above:

Seems like YT and tango knew

Yep. I didn’t think it was a big deal at the time, as I just thought this was common knowledge, and I sure as shit didn’t think it was a big enough concern to start PMing people. Just FYI.


R224506
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Yoshiwa

9/11 truth?


R224507
3 years ago
Snark

Forbes

9/11 Truth?


R224508
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

“What is GNN?

Guerrilla News Network is an independent news organization with headquarters in New York City and production facilities in Berkeley, California. Our mission is to expose people to important global issues through cross-platform guerrilla programming.”:http://www.gnn.tv/about/faq.php#1

So, those that are clearly on the GNN payroll all just happen to think 9/11 truth is not an important global issue to expose people to?

Post Modified: 09/28/06 14:51:32

R224510
3 years ago
tango

Isn’t this discussion being held in at least six other threads?


R224515
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Which ones?


R224517
3 years ago
Snark

So, those that are clearly on the GNN payroll all just happen to think 9/11 truth is not an important global issue to expose people to?

Hmmm…yup. That’s what it looks like. What’s your point?


R224519
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

That this is looking to be another left gatekeeper news site.


R224523
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Snark, why must you stand guard at the gate as well?


R224524
3 years ago
Snark

Just to reiterate:

You do realize that people can be totally uninterested and/or unconvinced by some or all of the assertions of the 9/11 truth movement and not be in on a conspiracy, paid shills, CIA disinfo spooks, or Republican activists, right? Just checking. Because that’s where you seem to be driving with that post.

You seem to have not internalized what I was saying there. Try reading it slowly and carefully.

Suck it up and realize that not every “leftist” is going to immediately jump on board the 9/11 truth train, ok? Some people find it convincing, some don’t. Those that don’t aren’t necessarily gatekeepers or your enemies or part of a conspiracy or have something to kide. They just don’t find it convincing. Or they find some of it convincing and some of it to be intellectually bankrupt idiocy, and can’t stand the credulousness and idealism of the leaders of the 9/11 truth movement, like me. But to paint everybody who doesn’t drink your particular flavor of kool-aid as “gatekeepers” or other such silly ad-homs is pretty weak sauce.


R224525
3 years ago
FloydAnderson


R224527
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Alright, what aspects of the official 9/11 story do you have problems with?


R224528
3 years ago
Snark

Snark, why must you stand guard at the gate as well?

Floyd, are you normally this obtuse, or do you just slip into it when it comes to this particular topic? See above: Or they find some of it convincing and some of it to be intellectually bankrupt idiocy, and can’t stand the credulousness and idealism of the leaders of the 9/11 truth movement, like me.

I am not your enemy. I just don’t share your ideological convictions about 9/11. See if you can try to wrap your mind around the fact that the spectrum of opinion is not monochromatic.


R224529
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Is there anything wrong with the 9/11 Commission Report not mentioning anything about WTC Building 7?


R224530
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Of course there is.


R224533
3 years ago
Snark

Alright, what aspects of the official 9/11 story do you have problems with?

The stand-down of air defenses. The bizarre happenings that seem to have centered on Norman, Oklahoma. The hints of ISI involvement. The testimony of Sibel Edmonds, before she was gagged. Administrative reluctance to open a 9/11 investigation. The insider trading. The wargames simulating the events of 9/11 as they were happening. The fact that the entire chain of command seemed to be incommunicado for hours after the attack happened. I could go on for a while, but I think you get my point.


R224534
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

No, go on.


R224535
3 years ago
Snark

Of course there is.

Thanks for answering for me.


R224537
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Sure, I thought I’d save you some typing time.

Post Modified: 09/28/06 15:35:30

R224552
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Great blog Rich!


R224553
3 years ago
Joshua_McNair

Don’t say obtuse! It makes certain people angry!


R224556
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Hmmm…..I recognize your style Joshua.


R224604
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Silverback is off my friends list. I no longer consider him honest.

Shogo was/is on the GNN payroll. That’s just great.


R224635
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Namaste_Rich for Investigative Journalist of the Week!


R224640
3 years ago
senssensibilityr

I’m glad Shogo was on the GNN payroll.

And I wish he did everything possible to destroy 9/11 TWOOF on this site. And turned it into a CIA front. How ‘bout that Floydie?


R224641
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:13:45

R224642
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:14:06

R224643
3 years ago
Wombat

Did I hear the sound of pants being unziped.


R224644
3 years ago
carcinogen

That’s gross… Sloppy seconds? More like sloppy three-hundred twenty-seconds”


R224646
3 years ago
Wombat

“He should have been impeached, convicted and jailed”

Ooooohhhhh no no no no. That would cause toooooo many questions Mr Thompson, to many questions that might require answers, better that he just quietly resigns and sliks away.


R224647
3 years ago
Wombat

“More like sloppy three-hundred twenty-seconds”

And thats just this week!!!!!!!!!!


R224652
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:14:18

R224664
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:14:24

R224667
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:14:30

R224669
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/18/09 11:54:54

R224671
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:12:27

R224673
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:14:38

R224696
3 years ago
Wombat

Back and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the leftBack and to the left


R224706
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

R224722
3 years ago
qui_vive

“What is going on here?

Uh, three people who aren’t interested in 9/11 Truth are running a website.”

Brilliant


R224736
3 years ago
gaanjah_mama

Did I hear the sound of pants being unziped?


R224740
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:12:17

R224745
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

....

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:11:43

R224747
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:11:55

R224750
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:12:02

R224756
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

...

Post Modified: 11/17/09 17:12:09

R224761
3 years ago
Snark

G-mama, you complete me.


R224768
3 years ago
ZenSwashbuckler

I dislike this label “9/11 truth” as it has come to be used.

It’s a crusader name, and some of its proponents have as much evidence and ratiocination as the original crusaders themselves.

But the base meaning, the desire to learn the actual truth about what occurred on 9/11, and how & why, is a legitimate endeavor that I support and share. I just don’t roll with unsupported accusations.

I add to Snark’s list above the fact that it was just too fucking perfect – pre-9/11 I saw people turning if not en masse then at least in a curious multitude or two, toward asking real questions about the world’s power structures, only to duck their mainstream heads right back down in the dirt come Tuesday morning. Cui bono, bitches? It wasn’t Muslims, or Afghanistan, or Iraq, or even most of al Qaeda (remember how many of them we killed in Afghanistan?). The answer’s on our front stoop.

But don’t give me shit about explosives or missiles until such time as you have better than circumstantial evidence for it! It makes all of us look like retards for even asking some of the same questions. Modern political action is a marketing campaign, difficult and painful as that is to swallow (fucking blech). In my most paranoid moments I wonder if half the so-called “9/11 truth movement” isn’t composed of shills – you know, false-flag fuckers performing roughly the same function for the 9/11 discovery agenda that early Malcolm X performed for the civil rights agenda (ask Odin to quote some for you) before he realized the deeper picture.

Because the truth is that we’ll need Middle America to ask these questions too, if we want them answered to even the remotest degree of satisfaction. It’s either that or get them (all 200 or so million of them, optimistically) out of the way somehow – which I’m fairly sure nobody wants or even thought of. So how the fuck are you going to convince them there are questions they should be asking when the first thing out of your mouth is how their whole memory of what they saw and heard is bullshit? They’re not going to listen to you! You can’t whack them over the head with the truth in great big fucking oak planks of it – you have to plant the seeds of doubt first, work gradually. If the red pill is too big to swallow, they’re not gonna go for it, no matter how much you think it would be good for them.

Let’s be clear: I’m not by any means ruling out things like explosives a priori. I have no evidence for doing so. But I have no evidence in favor of the explosives theory either, so the best possible thing we can do with that issue for now is table it until there’s good evidence either way, and use our silence on that as the honesty necessary to get into the heads of dreaded Middle America. Because once the Fuckers are in prison, we can get that information out of them (and no, we won’t do it by cruel and ineffective Abu Ghraib means), but we can’t get the Fuckers in prison if aforementioned Middle America thinks we’re a bunch of morons.

I don’t know, maybe there’s a way to get “most people” to ask the right questions by continuing to spout things without evidence. But I doubt it. And we don’t need those accusations in order to assemble a perfectly good case for impeachment, trial, and execution.

Post Modified: 09/28/06 21:46:57

R224777
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

ZenSwashbuckler, the respect I had for you is gone.


R224782
3 years ago
Snark

ZenSwashbuckler, the respect I had for you is gone.

Funny, my respect for him has increased.

Bonus for “Cui bono, bitches?” Latin always sounds better with “bitches” at the end.

Like this.

Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem, bitches!

Post Modified: 09/28/06 22:07:24

R224783
3 years ago
tango

Amazing post, Zen.


R224785
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Funny, my respect for him has increased.

Oh Jesus, just type 9/11 truth into google you idiot.


R224787
3 years ago
Snark

Plainly you haven’t read a fucking thing he posted.

Or if you did, your biases prevented comprehension. Either way…

Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem…biyatch.

Post Modified: 09/28/06 22:24:43

R224788
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Amazing post, Zen.

I was absolutely blown away.


R224789
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Tango and Snark are siamese bitches.


R224790
3 years ago
Snark

Floyd = brian?

Post Modified: 09/28/06 22:14:53

R224793
3 years ago
Wombat

What are the chances of there ever being another enquiry into Sep11.

Bzzzt – Nill.

In 30yrs, if anyone is still around, it will be talked about in the same breath as teh Kennedy assasination. Fascinating speculation but absolutly no proof of anything.

Post Modified: 09/28/06 22:21:36

R224794
3 years ago
Snark

It 30yrs, if anyone is still around, it will be talked about in the same breath as teh Kennedy assasination.

Naturally.


R224795
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

I’l fight against that prediction.


R224796
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

The Globalists really fucked up with 9/11. It was way too obvious.


R224797
3 years ago
ZenSwashbuckler

I’l fight against that prediction.

And I’ll fight by your side. I just doubt the best way to do it is with what amounts to wild and fantastical speculation. But never doubt our goals are the same.


R224799
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Type things into google and cross-reference.


R224802
3 years ago
Wombat

“I’l fight against that prediction.”

Its been five years now and how far have we really got.

“The Globalists really fucked up with 9/11. It was way too obvious.”

Look at the Kennedy assisination and its obviously not the work of a “Lone Gunman” but what difference has it made.

Dont get me wrong in any way shape or form I would love the whole thing to be blown wide open, but realisticaly your pushing shit uphill with a pencil.

The boys at the top control the game from start to finish and the angry masses are simply spectators.


R224805
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

That’s what I’m fighting against, and I will not stop. The 9/11 Truth Movement is growing. If you want to kill me, then kill me.


R224806
3 years ago
tango

Floyd.

I respect Snark, I respect Zen, I respect you.

And I don’t think those are mutually exclusive.


R224807
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Oh, Jesus.


R224809
3 years ago
FloydAnderson

Oh, I’m weeping. This is a charade.


R224811
3 years ago
Wombat

Do you think that the truth of Sep11 will bring down the elite power structure??

Oppressed people from assorted countries have tried to wrest power from their elites and so far what has been done. Even when a revolution suceeds it never returns power to the people it invariably just reshufles the cards at the top and puts in a new lot of power hungry fucks. A vicious circle of life.


R224812
3 years ago
Snark

On the way to becoming a farce, it appears.

Floyd, chill out and cut the dogmatism, ok?

Post Modified: 09/28/06 22:37:04

R224814
3 years ago
tango

What is this, fuck with tango night? I honestly don’t have a problem with a single person on this site, and I don’t want that to change.


R224852
3 years ago
Not_Uberche

“That’s what I’m fighting against, and I will not stop. The 9/11 Truth Movement is growing. If you want to kill me, then kill me.”

wow… that was a rational response…

“What is this, fuck with tango night?”

I think you wandered into the wrong threads tonight… you didn’t agree with Floyd so you deserved what you got. Disagree again and the anger will grow until one day BAM! Attack blog!! Careful.


R225113
3 years ago
devilsavocado

So What is your alibi Stephen?

Darios has a valid case for expecting a reply.


R225117
3 years ago
Chickenma1

_the best possible thing we can do with that issue for now is table it _

Quick, hide the smoking gun!


R225480
3 years ago
deadender

much like my shit when I drink too much Scotch some threads dribble on and on with no end in site.

Stephen and Darios sittin in a tree’bump


R226575
3 years ago
BlackPacker

Bump.

Where’s the blog go? Where’d 123 go? Where’d the USIA comment go? Something funys been going on here today…

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